I like this idea the best, Bullseye, but we must have a list of books to vote before that, then…
Ok, something like start voting 2 weeks before moon, final decision 3 days before, the 25th of each moon.
Nice. Suggestions for books?
Do you know “the Venus of Ille” by Prosper Merimee? I find it to be one of the best fantastic short stories I know.
Kurt Vonnegut’s “Breakfast of Champions”
Voltaire’s “Candide”
JD Salinger’s “Catcher in the Rye”
Those are my suggestions. 
Hunger by Knut Hamsun
Doesn’t it have sexual content? 
I’m not sure of how explicit this book is… (I’m not sure of how explicit should be allowed in the circle… The bare mention of sex/violence should be a big no–no or—well, if not, how can we decide between which books to allow and which can’t go? This should be discussed and defined before the next Moon so that we don’t have to go through all that discussion every time someone suggests a book with explicit content…)
Well, here’s my idea for how to resolve this:
Take a vote amongst mods in the mod forum(
)
Take a vote amongst members.
The poll could be something like:
How much explicit content should be allowed in the books we read for the reading circle?
-none
-a little
-a moderate amount
-no limits
And majority rules.
No limits is already prohibited. And a moderate ammount, if I understand what you mean, is so too. We need to define what ‘a little’ explicit means, though.
I think the mods could discuss this, but I would define a moderate amount as slightly frequent swear words, and a few sex scenes and a few instances of drug use, as long as sex or drugs is not the subject of the book, or glorified.
I would define a little as a swear word here and there, mabye one no-so-hot sex scene and some drug mentions, but certianly not any drug content involving anything like heroin or those types of things. Mabye a few mentions of pot, alcohol, or psycheldellics used for religious purposes ONLY(like in many of Carlos Casteneda’s book).
And none, well none is none.
What?? From what I remember, theres only a small part where he fondles a girl against her will when he comes into her house, but shes not nude really, and he soon leaves afterwards. Thats the only sexual content I remember. Theres no violence either unless you count some self-destructive episodes, but nothing really like cutting or suicidal, I think just banging his head against the wall.
But I could check again…
Definetely little.
I do recall him bleeding in one part of the book, but everything physically violent he does to himself.
Well, then there’s no problem with that book
Ok, whoever made a suggestion: are you guys willing to host the circle for a moon or do you want someone else to do the job? Also, can you give us a short summary of the books’ plots so we can make a poll?
I’d rather someone else host the circle.
Hunger is a novel inside the mind of a man, who is in a European city, starving. Hes poor not because of the society as much as because of his sometimes impulsive behavior and listlessness. He goes between mood swings where he entertains big ideals for himself then sinks back into his feelings of degeneration. He is an aspiring writer, but the newspaper editor he goes to gives him money out of compassion rather than for his pieces(it is somewhat implied he doesn’t use them). The book is plotless, but the deep psychological portrayal kept me interested when I read it.(The author won the nobel prize for that aspect)
Well, I voulenteered before, but was told I could not because of my lack of involvment in the previous circle. Seeing as there are no voulenteers, I will put myslef out there again, if it is alright with the mods.
The city is kristiania
Kristiania is another word for Oslo which is the capital of Norway 
I ahve read other books of hamsuun , but ive ehard that Sult (hunger in english)
2 sec. norwegian class
To be (very) hungy=å sulte
anyways , fun fact , we have a cabin not long from the place where knut hamsun were borna and raised. 
I have some thoughts on this, when I first saw the reading circle I was excited about discussing intelligent literature, but then I was extremely dissapointed by the choices.
These would have been amazing choices in my mind, enitrely clean, the only possible offensive material contained in them is the philosophy itself. Nietzsche calls down from the mountain that “God is dead” and Engels and Marx call for the need of a proletariate revolution. Heavy philosophy and discussions. It was mentioned that classic works of literature such as these would alienate younger members, but it works the other way too, selections that cater to the younger members simply alienate members that can understand the philosophy in works such as these.
Perhaps two groups should be made, one for simpler literature and one for people who have read Kafka.
As for obscenity in literature on the forum, well I have mixed thoughts. I can understand why it may not be an appropriate choice to select Naked Lunch(I couldnt finish it, it had some very interesting ideas, but I have no interest in reading some of what it contained), where the content is beyond excessive, but literature such as On the Road should be allowed. Yes the book contains mentions of sex and drugs, but the focus of the novel is not them, and the importance of the work itself should transcend any objections to its slightly objectionable content. Also parents who have heard of On the Road would most likely be proud of their son/daughter reading intelligent literature.
Either way there is plenty of novels and books to choose from that have no offensive content that could be read. Crime and Punishment - Dostoevsky, Waiting for Godot - Becket, The Stranger - Camus, The Trial - Kafka, Heart of Darkness - Conrad, No Exit - Sartre
I cant think of anything anyone would have a problem with in them, and you could always just go for more philisophical texts, Geneology of Morality - Nietzsche or Freedom from the Known - Krishnamurti.
Some of the great novels do contain material that is somewhat offensive,that is true and the nature of classic literature, but there are plenty of things that do not. I would love to discuss Philip K. Dick here, but I would love just as much to discuss Dostoevsky and Kafka.
and what about short stories and poems? It can take a very long time to read some of these novels can be extremely complicated and challenging to read(Nietzsche… 
)even if you are used to doing so. Short stories and plays and be just as enlightening, but do to their brevity take 20 minutes to read, not weeks(Dostoevsky).
/me hides behind the couch 
Heh, it’s riddiculous that so–called liberal countries all over the world are forbidding people of reading stuff because it’s “subversive” or “alienating”. I trust one can see that the selection I had first made was very political, and not unilateral.
The Karamazov Brothers (Dostoievski) is probably the greatest piece of Realistic litterature ever. Heavy, painful, highly symbolic.
Thus Spoke Zarathustra (Nietzsche) should be read by everyone in this world. It’s so sad! It shows you the terror that goes in the mind of one who has lost faith in his god, and tries to find Him in vain attempts after having lost him.
The Dirty Hands (Jean–Paul Sartre) is a play, discussing machiavellic ethics. Great read.
The Communist Manifesto (Engels and that other guy) (lol one can tell if I like Marx or not)… Seriously, I don’t get why people refuse to read it. I think no–one can discuss (make good or bad remarks to) communism without having read it. The Marxist revolution model is no longer possible, society has changed, that specific dream of a proletarian revolution is over. Why not discuss it? Why fear it? There’s no spell in that book, fearing it is as silly as not pronouncing Voldemort’s name. It’s iconifying, as if the book was communism itself, not just a book, and once you read it, communism would be installed in your mind, like a computer virus, but forever.
Animal Farm (Orwell). Another fantastic must–read book that has some very dated ideas and some universal discussions.
We (Zamiatin) is the ultimate criticism to the Russian Communism and any ultrapaternalist dictatorship (like Nazism). It’s a heavy romance about what happens when people try to become the same. It’s the book that inspired 1984, and it’s FAN-TAS-TIC. Interesting to see how the Sovietic Union and the nowadays USA are the same from Zamiatine’s point of view, how the “be the same, think the same, be part of your goverment and nothing else” culture can destroy that what’s ultimately human in all of us.
Or, or, if LD4All’s reading circle isn’t working ( 
), we could start a reading group with some interested members…
I have mixed feelings too. I also think it would be simply great to have beatnik litterature in this circle (Basilus would also love that), but I think the best police we can addopt while tryin to keep to the forum rules is to avoid any book with any more than a mention at all. d= That’s a problem about having a reading circle in an international forum, we have to bear with that to keep it moving.
/me jumphugs Ferks 
Yes, plays are nice. The Dirty Hands, as I suggested, or Between Four Walls, by Sartre… Mystery Buff by Maiakovski (I remember someone read that book during the reform and said “this is Russia”)… Geez, even Hamlet can give a nice discussion while being an easy read!
seems an understandable policy, slightly disappointing but not terrible as it does make sense. Theres also always pm’s if the desire arises.
gets pounced on by Bruno 
I was thinking of things that could be read in one sitting 30 and less . For Esme with love and squalor(14 pages) or Just before the war with the Eskimos(8) by Salinger, maybe some Hemmingway’s shorts or James Joyce. If we just did short stories and essays most are availble online to read which could simplify things and since they are short it would be easier to get more people interested to join the discussions. 10 pages of reading vs 300. 10 is a bit less intimidating making more people likely to do the reading which makes for more interesting discussions. Also with short stories it is quite easy to read the story multiple times to further understand it and look up quotes.
Ok, here would be my choice:
One Flew Over The Cuckoo’s Nest
Ken Kesey
Slaughterhouse-Five: Or The Childrens Crusade: A Duty-Dance With Deatch
Kurt Vonnegut
The Jungle
Upton Sinclair
Catch-22
Joseph Heller
Player Piano
Kurt Vonnegut
Cat’s Cradle
Kurt Vonnegut
Les Miserables
Victor Hugo
Fight Club
Chuck Palahnuik
Fahrenheit 451
Ray Bradbury
1984
George Orwell, aka Eric Blair
Animal Farm
George Oewell, aka Eric Blair
Death Of A Salesman
Arthur Millet
The Picture of Dorian Grey
Oscar Wilde
Mind introducing us to them? I personally only know some of these books (and I didn’t know Fight Club was a book at all).
I suggest we read the short stories by Daniil Kharms and discuss absurdism. Or better yet: Kafka — The Metamorphosis, and then we post and read other absurdist and surrealist stories in the discussion thread.