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The truth about dreams

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bengoodger
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PostPosted: Mon 02 Oct, 2006  Reply with quote

Well, looking at children, if they're undergoing conscious or subconscious strain they'll wet the bed... Adults and teenagers tend to become moody and/or depressed when they feel bad about something on a subconscious level. It's mainly mood-based, i.e. if you're feeling subconsciously about something, you're likely to feel a long-term mood that connects to that, e.g. a long depression after bereavement, even though you've consciously "let go" and such.

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Bombax
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PostPosted: Mon 02 Oct, 2006  Reply with quote

I believe the scientific one. Our brain is an advanced neural net constructed out of thousands and thousands of neurons. These neurons have connections to eachother, electric ones, and by letting input signal's strength override a certain threshold, the neuron fires new signals. You learn and remember by letting the connectors, synapses, change the way and strength of the signal they give.

Learning computers have this ability. Some people, including myself, have written certain pieces of programming which basicly gives the computer a "brain". Which let's it learn. By ajusting the thresholds and output strengths you can get it to act differently in different situations.

When we dream, I believe that the brain tries to make sense of all these firing neurons which is basicly a dream.

I'll tell you guys what. I'll cook up my old learning program, and let it fire neurons randomly. And let's see what the computer will dream. :D Now imagine that. The current program I have are a group of little tanks, set out to orient themselves around objects and shoot at eachother. I must say, since they knew nothing from start on how to do this most efficiently, they have evolved very nicely ^^ So what do you think will happen? Will the tanks go around, not shooting, crashing into wall, doing strange things with their own orientation?

PS: the compution of the dream will take about 2 hours. They are evolving learners. I hope this will be interesting smile


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Keiiji
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PostPosted: Mon 02 Oct, 2006  Reply with quote

@2nd poster ,


when a big black tenticle monster is chasing me I only wish it was false , although in my dream it's usually running away


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Bombax
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PostPosted: Mon 02 Oct, 2006  Reply with quote

Python Angel wrote:
I believe the scientific one. Our brain is an advanced neural net constructed out of thousands and thousands of neurons. These neurons have connections to eachother, electric ones, and by letting input signal's strength override a certain threshold, the neuron fires new signals. You learn and remember by letting the connectors, synapses, change the way and strength of the signal they give.

Learning computers have this ability. Some people, including myself, have written certain pieces of programming which basicly gives the computer a "brain". Which let's it learn. By ajusting the thresholds and output strengths you can get it to act differently in different situations.

When we dream, I believe that the brain tries to make sense of all these firing neurons which is basicly a dream.

I'll tell you guys what. I'll cook up my old learning program, and let it fire neurons randomly. And let's see what the computer will dream. :D Now imagine that. The current program I have are a group of little tanks, set out to orient themselves around objects and shoot at eachother. I must say, since they knew nothing from start on how to do this most efficiently, they have evolved very nicely ^^ So what do you think will happen? Will the tanks go around, not shooting, crashing into wall, doing strange things with their own orientation?

PS: the compution of the dream will take about 2 hours. They are evolving learners. I hope this will be interesting smile


Wow. I computed it and the result was remarkable. The tanks were in fact dreaming! My computer was dreaming! This is what happened. Normally the tanks wander around looking for opponents to shoot at. But when I added in their complete AI a system for dreaming, by letting their neurons fire randomly, this is what happened.

Instead of searching properly the tanks wandered around in the rooms I created for them. But most astonoshing was eek2 eek2 eek2 the tanks, when they found another tank, started to circle eachother and then move on. Wow. Interesting how a computer dreams ^^


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silverwater
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Well...
PostPosted: Tue 03 Oct, 2006  Reply with quote

Scientific or Paranormal...
I don't see why they have to form a conflict.

I mean, science can prove how the physical world works...
...that doesn't mean it disproves any existence of soul or spirit

Skeptics should be skeptical and metaphysicians should be aware of the skeptics' theory.

...and I think that should be the end.


I mean, that so-called North and South...
I think they're both right.
Or, to be more precise, I think they are two sides of the same coin.
And what we need to do is to know the coin,
not taking sides.


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bengoodger
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PostPosted: Tue 03 Oct, 2006  Reply with quote

"Two sides of the coin" doesn't exist in this scenario. The other side of the coin would have to be entirely invisible, immeasurable, etc, and therefore it may as well not exist.

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Stormthunder
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PostPosted: Tue 03 Oct, 2006  Reply with quote

dreamland? wrote:
what im saying is you can take my side or your side.

Sides? Does it really matter? If you're happy with your dreams, what does it matter which side is right, anyway? I don't know what the truth is, and frankly, I don't really care. I don't believe in spirits and OBEs, but if proof came up suddenly, hit me on the nose to the contrary and made me believe it them, it would change absolutely nothing as far as my dreams are concerned. So I figure it's rather pointless taking "sides", and even more pointless debating over whose theory is correct. Come on, it doesn't matter! wink


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silverwater
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Okay... rephrasing
PostPosted: Wed 04 Oct, 2006  Reply with quote

bengoodger wrote:
"Two sides of the coin" doesn't exist in this scenario. The other side of the coin would have to be entirely invisible, immeasurable, etc, and therefore it may as well not exist.



Yup. It 'may' not exist, which means it 'may' exist as well.

What I'm trying to say is that they are not necessarily opposite.

You can believe in either way, but that doesn't mean you believe so because you're not the other way. I'm making this point because there is always a way for these two ideas to co-exist. I'm not saying that it's right, I'm just saying these two do not always have to form a conflict.

Besides, Stormthunder made a really good point. Everyone chooses their beliefs and that should be the end. Unless one can really disprove or prove an explanation perfectly, but even so, it won't change the fact that we will continue lucid dreaming.


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