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Is lucid a sin?-Part II

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fear
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PostPosted: Mon 08 Aug, 2005  Reply with quote

Kavaa I wouldn't talk bad of anothers way of life it's nothing for you to change what may be boring for you may be enjoyable for others. That is like saying that i would rather live in a big city rather then in a Small Backroad town.. it may suck for some in the city but others love it and some hate the small backroad town but others enjoy it. So I wouldn't say bad things about others life just enjoy your own wink ..

no i'm not a church going person at all but don't talk down to others it only makes you look bad. overspannen


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Shaper
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PostPosted: Mon 08 Aug, 2005  Reply with quote

omega3 wrote:
It goes toward dreaming in general... In the Middle Ages a sector in the Bible about witchcraft was mistranslated to mean dream recollection or similar. (correction?). I don't see how this is possible since God sent several vital messages using dreams.


Yes, St Jerome diliberatly mistranslated the hebrew word for recalling dreams into the greek word for witchraft when he did his Vulgate Translation for the Pope, because of a dream he had in which he was flogged for his dreamwork in front of an otherowrldy court. He took it as a sign that his dreamwork was sinful. if you ask me, it was his subconscious uncertainties about dreaming and his faith emerging in a nightmare as a result of repression..if I do say so myself tounge2


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Cairn
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PostPosted: Mon 08 Aug, 2005  Reply with quote

I don't think lucid dreaming is a sin, neither is pleasure, neither is sex after marriage. (And neither is going to the toilet for all of you who believe what the Simsons say)
I see nothing wrong with lucid dreaming, but as for the activities in the LD I think gunning down innocent children and enjoying it is still sick and evil, as to what Jeff said before about killing all the people when you change dreamscenes, that's not bad you're not really since they don't exist but in the case of gunning down innocents is more the fact you're enjoying breaking the first commandment. As for sex in an LD I have no idea, beause I don't think sex is inherantly evil it makes it difficult to decide, however I'm only 14 and I'm not really likely to be doing that in an LD soon so I have time to decide smile.

These are just my opinions, I am Catholic, and thus my view will be very different to a muslim or a buddist, and you are all entitled to your opinion.


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Randomman(newb)
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PostPosted: Mon 08 Aug, 2005  Reply with quote

if we have to wait to heaven to enjoy ourselfs then why bother living, i mean its not painful but theres no point and eventually it is painful because you get so bored you die of boardem.if thats the case then we are all for gods entertainment

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fear
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PostPosted: Mon 08 Aug, 2005  Reply with quote

"good things come to those who wait" hmm .. guess people don't believe in this anymore.. besides who says you can't enjoy yourself? I don't remember reading that anywhere?

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Shaper
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PostPosted: Mon 08 Aug, 2005  Reply with quote

Susan Ivanova wrote:
As for sex in an LD I have no idea, beause I don't think sex is inherantly evil it makes it difficult to decide, however I'm only 14 and I'm not really likely to be doing that in an LD soon so I have time to decide smile.


But see, that's the thing about some sins, they shouldn't be sinful.
Take sex for example, here are my reason it shouldn't be sinful;

1) It is essential for human survival. Without it we would go extinct.

2) It is good for you, you burn more colouries while having sex than you do on a treadmill for 1/2 an hour.

3) It's fun 8D

4) It is great to give an already stable relationship a kick up a notch. It can help you feel very close to your partner, which is a beautiful feeling.

So, why should it be sinful? "Because Jesus said so," is not an acceptable answer to me, afterall, he only actually said about 20% of what he is supposed to have said in the bible.
My point is, think for yourself. If you think, "Oh I can go shoot up a place in an LD and its not real so that's okay," that's your descision. I woudn't do it, but I'm not you and I havent thought about it like you have.
The only real sins in LDs are the ones that we decide upon, and ofcouse those will all be different depending on who you talk to.


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Kashmir
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PostPosted: Fri 12 Aug, 2005  Reply with quote

I still haven't formulated my opinions on this matter (talking about what you do in an LD), because there's a few different ways to see this. For Christians, it is said that the thought or will to do something is just as bad as the thing itself, because it is the same intention to do something against what God wants for you. But then again, I suppose if you had the urge to do anything sinful or just plain bad, the best place to do it would be in an LD, to get it out of your system. But I'm still not sure.

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MorMor
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PostPosted: Fri 12 Aug, 2005  Reply with quote

Well. LDing probably is a sin acording to the bibel.

But i could not care less about anny thing in the world.
I dont belive in god.
And if im wrong... well then im just gonna have to burn in hell for all eternety.


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dreamer_chick
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Is lucid a sin?-Part II
PostPosted: Sat 13 Aug, 2005  Reply with quote

well, I think in song of songs in the bible says 'my heart awakened in a dream'. This could be looked upon as a lucid dream....

And, if God gave us dreams, how could they be a sin?


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Alatar
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PostPosted: Sat 13 Aug, 2005  Reply with quote

The Church may say dreaming is a Sin, but the Church was made for Man not Man for the Church, just as the Sabbath was made for Man not Man for the Sabbath.

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Nevari
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PostPosted: Mon 29 Aug, 2005  Reply with quote

I don't think that there was much publicity on LD's in Ancient times so i doubt that they are gonna be mentioned in the bible. Also, even with the whole "shooting up innocents" thing i think that you probably shouldn't do that and that if you do you're a pretty violent person, however, if it stops you from going mad and killing people in RL then that's infinitly better and also the only sin I know of that is based on thought is coveting.

MorMor wrote:
But i could not care less about anny thing in the world.
I dont belive in god.
And if im wrong... well then im just gonna have to burn in hell for all eternety.


You probably aren't going to burn in hell, because the bible doesnt say anything about NOT worshipping god, it simply forbids you from worshipping other false gods/making and worshipping graven images, If someone condemns you simply point that out


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MedO
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PostPosted: Mon 29 Aug, 2005  Reply with quote

Whoever claimed sex was sinful? Could someone point me to the relevant bible quote?
Quite in contrary, I think it is something like a religious duty to ensure the survival of the species. "Be fruitful and multiply". Wasn't it straight in the beginning of that big book?

Well, the bad news is that sex before the marriage is a sin. And using condomes / other preventives, too. However, I don't know if those things are based on the bible, and many christians in probably couldn't care less...

As for gunning down people in an LD, it depends on the intention behind it. Somewhere in the mass the community says "I sinned in thoughts, words ans deeds" or similar. A sin always begins as a thought (i think a dream can be likened to a thought). If you take pleasure in the thought, you might make it reality. So, if you gun down people in an LD because you would like to do it IRL, or maybe find out in your dream that you would like, this makes it a sin.

Just my tho cents, and IANAT (I am not a theologist)

MedO


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Anamcara
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PostPosted: Mon 29 Aug, 2005  Reply with quote

Well, forgive the unbeliever but I think anybody telling somebody their imagination is gonna cause them time in purgatory is very cruel. Imagination was put there by God to be used to let this kinda stuff out among other things. There is a story, I think about Jung, who had all this guilt about a sudden vision of God taking a dump on a church or something and then he started laughing as he realized how foolish he was being for worrying about it so much

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MedO
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PostPosted: Tue 30 Aug, 2005  Reply with quote

I did not mainly talk about my own view of the world, but about the Catholic one, simply because some people seem to have a wrong idea about this point. But this perspective does have a point.

In my own view now, you may strangle every DC you come accross and feel happy about it, as long as you don't harm any real people. However, if you do things like that in a dream, it has a reason. There is probably a strong conflict with the people you try to kill in your dreams. And this conflict isn't resolved in any way by "letting of steam" in such a way.

You might feel better for a few days, but you will be hurt again by those people, and the "dream solution" will gradually stop working because you notice it doesn't really change anything. Then, just maybe, you will get so worked up that you do something stupid, possibly the thing that you practiced over and over in your dreams, and that felt so relieving at the time.

I don't want to imply that YOU would do that, of course. The point is that SOME people may.

MedO


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Basilus West
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PostPosted: Tue 30 Aug, 2005  Reply with quote

Quote:
Well. LDing probably is a sin acording to the bibel.

eek2 Where did you see that? The first quotes about lucid dreaming are from St Augustine. He didn't consider it as a sin. The Bible is full of dreams which can be considered as lucid. In the Little Philocaly of the Heart, orthodox monks use lucid dreaming in order to pray Jesus.
I don't see the reason why lucid dreaming would be a sin: it's not witchcraft.


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